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Yorgos Lanthimos, an acclaimed director from Greece, and Emma Stone, a talented American actor, make a formidable team. They first collaborated on The Favourite (2018), a dark comedy set in the past, which received 10 Oscar nominations and won seven Bafta awards. Since then, they have also worked on a short film called Bleat and the highly anticipated movie Poor Things, as well as another feature currently known as Kind of Kindness. Clearly, their partnership is incredibly fruitful.
In the film Poor Things, which has been described as a bizarre blend of science fiction and romantic comedy, Stone portrays Bella Baxter, a woman from the 19th century who has been reborn and is cared for by her paternalistic doctor, Godwin Baxter (played by a heavily made-up Willem Dafoe). She refers to him as “God” and has the brain development of a baby. While critics have struggled to categorize the film’s eccentricities (the Chicago Sun-Times described it as “visually bold… boldly crude” and Empire called it “completely insane and incredibly lewd”), Stone simply states that it is a story about a woman who is free from shame.
When I encounter Lanthimos in London, the promotional efforts for Poor Things’ Oscar campaign are gaining momentum, with numerous awards and nominations coming in after its Golden Lion victory at the Venice Film Festival in September. The film won’t be released in the UK for another two weeks, but it’s already generating the most buzz of any movie in 2024. However, Lanthimos, known for his other Oscar-nominated films Dogtooth (2009), The Lobster (2015), and The Favourite, seems surprisingly unaffected by all the excitement. He remains relaxed, easy-going, and amiable, in contrast to the tone of many of his films.
I remember when I first featured Dogtooth on Channel 4’s Extreme Cinema lineup a few years back, I was amazed by its unsettling and chilling satire. I also noted how the director, Lanthimos, steadfastly refuses to provide explanations for his often bizarre movies. “People are always trying to make me validate their interpretations, but I refuse to do so,” he once said. However, during our coffee conversation at a West End hotel, he seems more than willing to delve into the details and themes of his latest film, Poor Things. I wonder if he agrees with Stone’s concise summary of the film.
“Shame is a feeling that we are conditioned to experience in certain situations, but Emma’s character does not feel it,” he explains. “She never learned what shame is, so she is free to express her thoughts, opinions, and body without reservation.” I bring up his previous description of the film as being about a woman who gets a second chance. He subtly revises this statement, saying it is about “a human being who is given a chance in the world – someone who has not been molded to see the world in a specific way. She has a fresh start, allowing her to see things from a more open perspective. At 28 years old, she had previously lived an unsatisfying life. But now, with a clean slate, she can start again and take ownership of her life.”
Lanthimos and screenwriter Tony McNamara collaborated to adapt Poor Things, a renowned novel by Alasdair Gray published in 1992. Gray, a Scottish writer, was honored with both the Whitbread award and the Guardian Fiction prize for this book. In the Guardian’s 2019 obituary, he was described as the leading figure of the revival of Scottish literature and art. The novel is a lively parody of Victorian literature and follows the life of Bella Baxter through various contradicting versions. One version claims that Dr Godwin Baxter performed a brain swap between a drowned woman and her unborn fetus, resulting in a childlike adult with no moral code who sets off on a wild journey of self-discovery. Another dismisses these claims as absurd and resembling the morbid themes of the 19th century, accusing Gray of borrowing from other works such as Hogg’s Suicide’s Grave, Mary Shelley’s writings, and Edgar Allan Poe’s tales.
In 2011, Lanthimos initially asked Gray to adapt the book, but Gray had not yet seen any of Lanthimos’ films. Gray’s son had to teach him how to use a DVD player so he could watch Dogtooth, which he really enjoyed. Lanthimos was surprised that Poor Things had not been made into a movie yet.
He was impressed by the cinematic quality of it. Despite its complexity, it was evident that there was potential for a film adaptation. When he discovered that it had not been made yet, he immediately traveled to Scotland to meet the author. Upon arrival, the author greeted him and promptly took him on a fast-paced tour of Glasgow, as the novel is set in that city. They then returned to the author’s house where he expressed his belief in the filmmaker’s talent and offered him the opportunity to adapt his book into a film. After this encounter, the filmmaker returned to London and they did not discuss it further.
Did he stay true to the original?
To put it simply, the essence of the novel is reflected in the film, but with a different structure and narrative. The story is mainly told through the perspectives of various male characters, using literary devices to sometimes challenge or reveal their statements as false. However, for the film, the focus is solely on the protagonist’s journey and perspective. The decision was made to create this world through her lens, so the team built everything in a studio using traditional techniques, such as painting backdrops and constructing sets, to give a tangible feel to the world.
Lanthimos made a significant decision to exclude the “philosophical political essay” about Scotland’s relationship with England and the rest of the world from the novel. He believed it would not translate well into film and, as a Greek filmmaker, it would be insincere for him to make a movie about Scotland.
Gray was a strong supporter of socialism and Scottish nationalism, placing a great emphasis on politics. His most famous novel is often described as a “political allegory”. Lanthimos has tackled complex issues surrounding personal freedom and societal constraints in his films such as the elaborate mourning practices in “Alps” (2011) and the absurd “defining characteristics” in “The Lobster”. However, in the past, he has explicitly stated that he is a filmmaker and not interested in addressing politics or social problems. It is worth considering if his perspective has since changed and if he now views his films as having political or polemical themes.
I do not believe this statement is controversial, however I do acknowledge that it does have political implications, even though it does not explicitly align with a particular ideology. Creating films about real-world issues inherently involves a degree of political involvement – it is a form of commentary and a means of sparking discussions. Many thought-provoking films can be considered political in some capacity.
I am curious about the origins of Lanthimos’s inquisitive perspective on the world.
“I am still working on my craft every day,” he chuckles. “Growing up in Greece, I never could have imagined becoming a filmmaker.” Lanthimos, the son of a shopkeeper and a professional basketball player, initially studied business and marketing before realizing his true passion for directing. He then attended the Hellenic Cinema and Television School Stavrakos in Athens, where he focused on creating commercials, music videos, and dance films. At the time, he never thought he would have the opportunity to direct a feature film. “At that time in Greece, there was no film industry or tradition,” he explains. “There were only a few independent filmmakers, and it was difficult to secure funding. But at some point, I thought, ‘Why don’t we just make our own film? We don’t need much. We can get a camera, pay for film and lab costs, hire some actors, and find a location to shoot. What’s the worst that could happen?'” He never expected his work to gain recognition, but as people began to appreciate it, he realized that filmmaking could be a viable career. However, due to limited opportunities in Greece, Lanthimos eventually moved to London after completing three films in his home country. Despite the change in location, his approach remained the same.
Lanthimos and his spouse, Greek-French performer Ariane Labed (who makes an appearance in both Alps and The Lobster), came back to Athens in 2021. However, the director still seems to be in his element here in London. As we request more coffee, I pause to confirm that my phone is recording our discussion. I apologize for my constant fear of technology failing me. I am a bit embarrassed, but Lanthimos is thrilled. “We are similar!” he exclaims. “That’s why I prefer to film everything on traditional film! I have tried digital filming for a few movies and I absolutely despised it.”
I inquired about Lanthimos’ specific grievances with shooting on digital, but it appears he dislikes everything about it!
“He expressed his dissatisfaction with the filming process, explaining how being on set and watching the footage on the monitor felt like watching a soap opera. This distraction made it difficult to fully understand and appreciate the end result, which then had to be edited and improved during post-production. Instead of enjoying a creative experience, there was a constant effort to fix and enhance the final product, especially in terms of skin tones and texture. He also noted that using film instead of just pressing a button added a sense of preciousness to the process. As a result, he has become more dedicated to using film, even going as far as building a darkroom studio in Athens for developing and printing his own photos. During the filming of Poor Things, he would take photos on set using film and then develop them with Emma after shooting, using it as a way to wind down after a busy day.”
I inquire about Lanthimos’ artistic collaboration with Emma Stone and the progress of their current project, which was originally called AND but has since been renamed Kind of Kindness.
“He has confirmed that the filming is complete and editing has begun. The film is set in modern times in the United States and features three separate stories. Four or five actors play different roles in each story, creating a total of three different characters for each actor. In essence, it was like making three films in one. It is a pleasure to work with Emma again, as her trust in me and my trust in her makes the process much smoother.”
Lanthimos describes his approach to casting as “intuitive” and recalls meeting Stone for the first time, immediately sensing that they would work well together. After seeing her previous work, he believed she would be perfect for The Favourite. Stone was also familiar with Lanthimos’ films and was eager to collaborate. He praises her dedication and ability to understand without needing excessive explanation. For Lanthimos, it is a pleasure to communicate with someone who shares his creative vision and can make it a reality.
The importance of this type of imaginative closeness is essential for Poor Things, especially because the main character, Bella, faces a series of revealing challenges for the performer.
“Without a doubt. However, when we created Poor Things, we had already worked on The Favourite and had formed a friendship. Later, we collaborated on the silent film Bleat for the Greek National Opera while in Greece. It was a unique and memorable experience, especially since Emma joined us on an island. It was reminiscent of our early filmmaking days in Greece.”
Emma Stone, who has been nominated for an Oscar three times and won for her role in La La Land, was reportedly the highest-paid actress in the world in 2017. However, according to director Lanthimos, she is more interested in working on smaller passion projects rather than big Hollywood blockbusters. Lanthimos recalls working on “Bleat” with a small crew of 10 on a remote island during winter. Stone expressed her desire to make all films in this intimate setting, questioning why there is a need for a large production crew. Lanthimos shares that he has always strived for this type of intimate filmmaking since the beginning of his career. He was able to achieve this on “Poor Things” by hanging lights from the ceiling and only having essential crew members present in the room.
We discuss Jerskin Fendrix, a British musician who was nominated for a Golden Globe and created the diverse and dynamic score for Poor Things. When Lanthimos first listened to Fendrix’s album Winterreise in 2020, he immediately felt a connection with another creative partner. The album contains a range of sounds and emotions, including humor and drama. It has a playful tone but can also be heavy when necessary. Lanthimos was drawn to the unique and beautiful sound and believed it would fit perfectly with the world of Poor Things. When he played it for Emma, she remarked that it was as if his thoughts had been transformed into music.
Fendrix’s music effectively connects the audience of Poor Things with the film’s unconventional emotional core. It is worth noting that Lanthimos’s films often have thought-provoking concepts (such as the value of one life over another in The Killing of a Sacred Deer), but they succeed because they evoke a strong visceral response, whether it be discomfort, tears, or laughter. Lanthimos himself acknowledges this, stating that the ability to evoke emotion is more important than intellectual analysis. He believes that without feeling something in the moment, a film loses its purpose.
What causes Lanthimos to laugh?
“Mark Ruffalo is rehearsing!” he responds right away (the actor is a strong contender for an Oscar for his comical role as Bella’s arrogant and foolish love interest, Duncan Wedderburn), before giving a more thoughtful answer: “I think it’s the awkwardness of human interaction and behavior that makes me laugh.” I question if Lanthimos also sees a philosophical connection between the manufactured, artificial worlds of Poor Things and Dogtooth, where a domineering father keeps his children locked up at home, cut off from the outside world with fabricated stories about miniature planes and deadly cats.
The concept of Bella’s confinement and her lack of understanding of the outside world is a prominent theme in Dogtooth, according to the director. However, Poor Things delves into what happens after she is released. The director admits that he did not initially make the connection when reading the novel, but during filming, the similarities between the two stories became evident. Dogtooth examines the limitations of family and societal influences on human perception. Poor Things builds on this idea and explores how it affects individuals when they enter the real world.
Is there a specific film that Lanthimos prefers from his own works?
He lets out a sigh and says, “They are all challenging kids, each in their own unique way.”
Does he ever watch them again?
“I had the chance to watch The Favourite, Dogtooth, and Sacred Deer about a year ago. With the pandemic going on, I decided to revisit them and see what I thought of them now. I was pleasantly impressed.”
Surprised how?
“I actually thought they were worse!” he chuckles. “But when I saw them, I was pleasantly surprised. It’s not as bad as I thought it would be. It actually works well. Of course, no film can be perfect, but it’s well crafted and there are some intriguing ideas present. That was my intention with this project.”
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2022
The film Poor Things will be released in UK theaters on January 12, 2022.
Source: theguardian.com
